Replacing a 2JZGTE harmonic balancer/torsional dampener

[Howieau]

I have a friend of mine who has a 2JZGTE in a JZA80 Supra.

His harmonic balancer/torsional dampener has begun to crack and needs to be replaced. A workshop that he usually takes his car to wants $1500 to replace it with a billet pulley. I'm not sure what sort of billet pulley this is, whether its an underdrive or if its setup the same as the standard. I've never worked with a torsional dampener before but $1500 sounds very steep for such a job, and I've tried to convince him into learning how to do the job himself to save him some money. I would've thought it would be similar to a normal engine crank pulley in removal/reinstall. Keeping in mind his CAS setup aswell.

What is involved exactly in replacing a torsional dampener?
Would the steep cost come from the pricing of the billet dampener, or perhaps having the new dampener balanced (if this is required).

His engine is bone stock aswell, would a billet dampener even be worth doing? Should he just replace it with another standard one which is already setup for his stock engine.

I just cant get my head around the cost so I guess I'll ask first before I try and convince him any further.

Thanks in advance

[The Real Roadrunner]

aftermarket crank pulleys of decent quality are about $570US + shipping so say around $700 by the time it gets to your door, i cant see how its an $800 job to fit it though

probly $200 at the most for labour to fit it to the car but it depends on what needs to be removed around it.

cheers
linden

[jeffro ra28]

changing a balancer should be 3 hours labour at most!!!!

See here http://www.rosstuffbond.com.au/pages/metal_jacket.html
these guys make billet "metal jacket" balancers for the 2jz, If they do not want you to deal direct contact hi octane racing. www.hioctaneracing.com.au

Should be no more then $500

Product is proven, they used to sponser my previous place of work. We have tried and tested their stuff time after time on severe duty applications.

[2jzhilux]

Ross deal direct as i bought one this year and they are about 550-600 delivered
Or send a pm to IS1000 on here he deals with them also and can do good prices.
Also shouldnt take any competant mechanic any longer than 3-4 hrs to fit
The hardest part is undoing the crank bolt as you may need an oxy to heat up the bolt

[JZA70 R]

IMO, my advice would be to purchase a replacement oem h/b from your local toyota dealership, since the supra is stock. they are around $400.

Then its up to you if you want to attempt to do the install yourself, or pay a mechanic.

If you decide to do it yourself you will need to aquire a harmonic/gear/pulley puller which isnt a common tool in your average joe's tool collection.

Beware some aftermarket harmonic balancers not only require a the purchase of a smaller serp belt due to the h/b being underdriven, but also some aftermarket h/b are designed for 'built' motors that operate create different frequencies to a standard motor.

[jeffro ra28]

the only difference being more RPM's. Why not spend the extra $100 and get something far more competant of the oem part.

[JZA70 R]

how is the oem unit in-competent? ...it works flawlessly for fifteen years!

[jeffro ra28]

did i say in-competent? No. i said a aftermarket billet one is MORE competent.

AND why has it cracked originally? oem balancers are renowned for splitting! thats why they make billet aftermarket ones

[JZA70 R]

Are the ross balancers underdriven or are they a direct plug n play?

[JZA70 R]

2jzhilux says their 550 - 600 delivered, if you have someone that can purchase toyo genuine parts trade which isnt hard, you can get the oem balancer for closer to $350. Now the price different starts to become significant. If the ross balancers are under driven then you will need a new serp belt which is around $60 or more which would blow the cost out even further.

[2jzhilux]

They are the same size so a different sized belt wont be needed but i would put a new one on anyway.
They are also heavier than the original one but i had my internals balanced with this balancer so it wont make a difference to me.
I would get one over a stock balancer for sure because if you plan on going to the drags and doing under a 12 second 1/4 i think you need an sfi approved balancer.
They also have a lifetime warranty even if used in racing


Here is a pic of mine sorry about the quality

[jeffro ra28]

yes, and dealing direct with the manufacturer is almost always more expensive because they prefer to deal with their distributors. I can get a rb30 ross billet balancer from hi octane for around $350-$400. I dare say it would be very much similar to a 2jz H/B. Lets let Howieau make the choice as to which is more suitable for his freinds situation.

[2jzhilux]

Yeah i said that price because i wasnt sure what level of trade discount Howieau could get if any. Best to ring and find out
I still find it a little hard to get trade discounts on performance stuff because my work doesnt have accounts with any performance shops (which sucks) but they seemed happy to give me trade discount because it got delivered to work and the guy seemed real nice to deal with also

[jeffro ra28]

thats probalby ross clothier, ex policeman lol

[Howieau]

2jzhilux, Ive did some research regarding the harmonic balancer/torsional damper before I posted this and from what I understand balancing the torsional damper (referring to 2jz here) has nothing to do with the main purpose of the dampener itself. Apparently people use aftermarket applications and think that as long as its balanced everything will work fine, it seems this is not the case. For balancing purposes getting it balanced is a good idea, but it wont change its capabilities to absorb crank vibrations. Not saying you think that 2jzhilux, just putting this out there for anyone else who may be reading and not fully understand it (which was me a few days ago )

The torsional vibrations that the damper works to prevent/dampen are caused when a cylinder fires. The force of the piston being pushed downward can actually cause the crank to flex a little or vibrate. The frequency of these vibrations is determined by the power strokes of the engine. If the frequency of the vibrations match the resonate frequency of the crank, then itll destroy a crank very quickly. Im sure the resonate frequency on a stock 2jz crank is not within its factory RPM range or the dampener is effective enough to prevent any crank failure if it is within its RPM range otherwise Toyota wouldnt have it setup the way it is, but if you start revving the engine higher to the point of the crank vibrations matching the cranks resonate frequency and still using a standard dampener(which may not be designed to dampen as effectively at such high RPM or vibrations) then chances of screwing your crank increase. If your aftermarket damper is well designed and capable of high RPM dampening (if you run it to high RPM anyway) then you're all good.

See you could have a dampener that is balanced with the rotating assembly, but if it isn't designed for the frequency of the crank vibrations that the engine is likely to see, then it wont be as effective in preventing crank failure, even if it is balanced properly.

P.S. A cranks resonate frequency is determined by stiffness and mass, so by getting a heavier/lighter flywheel, or a differently weighted damper, youre changing the resonate frequency of the crank aswell.

This is as far as I understand at the moment anyhow.