3rzfe + turbo

[fezi]

G'day all,
I've been searching for a few days now for info on 3rz's. Specifically info regarding turboing them. I know plenty of them get turbo'd in the states but I'm looking for more local info.
My idea is to turbo the hilux, not after anything hugely powerful but would like more useable power. Looking at Autronic or Motec, custom ex manifold, keep the standard intake, 044 fuel pump, 600cc injectors and run a gt28rs for good low rpm response and a decent top end. Definetley dont want a dyno or dag queen hence the expensive ecu for closed loop control.
Any 1st hand experience or info would be greatly appreicated

[johnny]

G'day all,
Definetley dont want a dyno or dag queen hence the expensive ecu for closed loop control.
Any 1st hand experience or info would be greatly appreicated

then why do you want a GT28RS? A T28 etc will be fine and the Disco pot would be and over kill and under utilised running 7-10psi (about the most you'll run on a standard 3RZ)

[mullett]

I wounldn't spend the extra $$$ on such hi-end managment man, for what you're chasing (and it depends on your budget), anything this side of an SAFC would do the job Hell, you could even just get a microtech fuel controller and tune it up. Don't stress about closed-loop control, for the tiny amount of fuel you'll save, that's big dollars in managment. How much were you willing to spend? Be aware that this will be a BIG dollar build using the parts you've specified.

As for spool rates, you've got a fairly long stroke, large displacement 4cyl, so something a bit bigger (or cheaper) would spool just fine. Also compare the cost of transplanting a bigger engine in, or just getting a car with more power.

What exactly is your application, and what are you looking to spend?

Basic costing (using the parts you've selected)

Exhaust manifold: $800+
Intake system (cooler etc) $1000
GT28RS: $1600
Fuel system (that's big if you don't want major power) $800
Low-end MoTeC: $3000+ fitted and tuned
Exhaust: $800
Labour: $2000ish.
$10,000

How i'd do it (on a budget)
Manifold: $800 (can't get away from that unless you make your own)
Intake $1000 (same deal, if you can weld, you'll be laughing)
T3 from R33: $350-400
Microtech, fitted and tuned: $1800 (wire yourself, $1500)
Exhaust: $800
Fuel: $400 (if you can get supra injectors in there)
Labour: $2000 (unless you can install yourself)
$6000 ($3800 if you're a handyman)

For interests sake, these prices will drop if you can get bolt up bits from the states.

RM

[fezi]

Thanks for the replys.
Should have stated will be doing exhaust manifold myself, cooler piping. Also got ecu wire in covered. Basically only external costs will be ecu itself and turbo + intercooler plus the tune.
Closed loop control comes in handy for getting the green light from engineer and rta and way less hassels from plod. Budget whilst not unlimited is substantial so there is allowances there in case the motor or drivetrain goes pop during tuning phase.
Purpose of the project = why not. Need a ute to cart motorbike and assorted other shite. Cant justify another vehicle to the G/F but want something that is fun to an extent, yes I know it wont go around corners or handle anywhere near a decent uni-body but thats not why I have what I have. Also no point in doing a engine transplant as by the time a 1j or 1uzfe or something similar goes in I'v spent what I would have on throwing a turbo on the original.

[mullett]

Absolutely, you will spend a bit of dosh putting another motor in, but it has long term gains. If you're doing a lot of work yourself, expect about 5k if you're using an entry level ECU. Personally, I'd build the internals of the motor as well, or you're only going to be able to get 'about' a 30% increase (if that), which really isn't a lot for the money you've forked out. A 1UZ will allow you to run stock everything (how independent is the ECU in the new hiluxes from the body/interior loom? This might be a problem if you transplant) And they make mega power and torque...

If you really want to do it, and you can afford to have the car off the road for a while, then why not indeed. Just be prepared to spend some $$$ on suspention and braking as well, and some good tyres. Do you load it up heavily very often?

RM

[-==L=a=N=c=E==-]

http://ugbox.net/~lance/Turbo%20Hilux/

Have a read of that, i scanned taht in a few year ago when that ute was featured in Zoom. (it is currenty for sale on carsales)

I think the GT28RS would possibly be too small, unless you find the largest turbine available. And with that much torque on offer wouldn't be the nicest to drive i'd think.

[MS-75]

I'd have to agree and say you'll find a GT28 way too small. A GT 35 or 35-40 would be ideal as you'll find the stump-pulling torque of the 3RZ will prevent it being just a dyno queen.

One thing I'd recommend is that you put a set of head studs into it. The 3RZ is virtually a identical to my 4.5L 1FZ, except it's a 4 cyl, and I had a bit of drama with the plastic region head bolts. I used Supra (2JZ) studs, although there would be too many in a kit for you though.

THE source for 3RZ stuff is LC Engineering in the US (www.LCengineering.com)-that's where the ARE motor came from.

The 3RZ is an awesome platform to work with and will last forever at medium boost levels with completely std internals.

Sean

[AE86slut]

I remember writing an article for Zoom on the ARE 180SX and being in awe at what the 3RZ could achieve. They're making upwards of 700hp at the wheels with theirs.
Here's a link to the buildup page with a shite-load of info on the car. As mentioned, the motor was from LC Engineering in the States.

http://www.are.com.au/Big%20HP/grunter.htm

[-==L=a=N=c=E==-]

To the OP.

Instead of going motec/autronic, perhaps go and have a look at Wolf or Hlatech, as both have closed loop fuel control.

Also, instead of a GT28, the CT26 off a 7MGTE would proberbly be more suitable for the motor in question. If you leave it unopened. It should be plenty. Other options are the turbos of a 1JZ.

[fezi]

One thing I'd recommend is that you put a set of head studs into it. The 3RZ is virtually a identical to my 4.5L 1FZ, except it's a 4 cyl, and I had a bit of drama with the plastic region head bolts. I used Supra (2JZ) studs, although there would be too many in a kit for you though.

THE source for 3RZ stuff is LC Engineering in the US (www.LCengineering.com)-that's where the ARE motor came from.


Sean

Head studs are on the list of "must haves". I think they add a little to the stability of the bore as well as keeping the head on the block at higher boost levels although I dont want to boost a standard engine over 12-14psi.

LC Engineering are the number one source of 3rz and 2rz stuff but their web site seems to be in disagreement with my pc at the moment.

You dont happen to be Supercrown from PForums do you? That car is half the reason I choose a truck motor to mod.

Cheers for the help

[chris davey]

Mullett: I think you are underestimating the strength of the 3rz internals. In most cases, Toyota engines are overengineered and even on a high compression motor should be able to take a bit of punishment.

I agree that a T28 style turbo is too small for a 2.7L 4 cyl. The long stroke is going to help spool up a decent size turbo and you shouldn’t end up with a dyno queen. If you were going to shell out on a GT28rs, you may as well go for something like a GT30 with 1.06 rear or GT35 with .8 rear. A GT30 with .8 rear on a 1jz spools nearly as well as the stock ct12a’s (which are tiny) so with the larger exhaust housing it should spool very well on the long stroke 3rz. 1jz is a very short stroke motor and is not all that great at spooling large turbos.

Oh and there is no way I would use the stock ct12a’s. They run out of flow on stock 1jz’s at about 6000rpm. If you wanted to make it more difficult and use a twin turbos I would think twin t25g’s off an sr20 would be good and cheap

[The Witzl]

To the OP.

Instead of going motec/autronic, perhaps go and have a look at Wolf or Hlatech, as both have closed loop fuel control.

Also, instead of a GT28, the CT26 off a 7MGTE would proberbly be more suitable for the motor in question. If you leave it unopened. It should be plenty. Other options are the turbos of a 1JZ.

if the guy was already considering spending the $$$ on a GT-series b.bearing turbo, then why would be want to go BACKWARDS in performance and technology to the CT26?

I think Sean (MS-75) is wise enough and experienced enough to know what he is talking about. I would listen to his advice.

[chris davey]

nah that's not him. There are 2 crazy 1fz turbo crowns running 10's in Adelaide these days!

[-==L=a=N=c=E==-]

if the guy was already considering spending the $$$ on a GT-series b.bearing turbo, then why would be want to go BACKWARDS in performance and technology to the CT26?

I think Sean (MS-75) is wise enough and experienced enough to know what he is talking about. I would listen to his advice.

I was thinking in terms of if he wanted to save money somewhere. As not all of us are mega bucks into conversion type thing. Was only making suggestions. And i didn't get the impression that he had a lot of money to play with (like wanting a closed loop ecu for street... economy matters to him)

Just stating alternatives. Otherwise i would do what you have said. Go a GT30 or GT35 turbo with appropriate turbine housing. Even if it is a low boost application, or for the big power. Either way.

[The Witzl]

Some skillful shopping and resourcefulness will get you the turbo you want at a bargin price.

for example..... my GT25 440hp b.b. garrett only cost me $600 shipped from WA....