2T-GTE Sequential Injection and Ignition

[RAAAH23]

Hi guys thank you in advance for any help or info you may have for me.

So I am doing a 2T-GTE swap into my TA23. So far I've got the brakes, diff and fuel system upgraded. I'm planning on running E85/PULP98 with the haltech fuel flex sensor. I've spoken to my tuner (Jim at CRD) he is recommending I go full sequential injection and ignition as I'm looking to put out 300+rwkw (The motor made 210rwkw @18psi on 98RON without the forged bottom end and upgraded cams).

Currently it has a aluminum wheel on the crank with a rare earth magnet and hall effect sensor? Now to be able to run sequential inj and ignition the haltech (PS1000) will require a second crank/cam sensor located on the stock points dizzy. Obviously some modification to the distributot will be required. Now please correct me if I'm wrong but this second sensor will need 4 pulses per 360° rotation of the crank. Ive had a look at all the electronic dizzy threads but am still unsure if it would work.

I did find this product that might make it a bit easier but again am unsure if I would be just wasting my money. http://www.hot-spark.com/1-Nippondenso-Distributors.htm

With this the vacuum and mechanical advance will require removal and both plates will have to be welded together. Is there a certain position to weld the two plates?

So if you managed to get through all of that and have something to add please do. As you can see I'm trying my best to keep costs down and I knew from the start it wasn't going to be the cheapest or most bang for buck conversion but I've never herd of a 2TG making 300kw at the wheels so I've got that going for me which is nice haha

Again thanks

[TA22 GT]

Hi,
The problem with a crank sensor is it doesnt know if its the compression or exhaust cycle because the crank rotates twice as many times as the cams.

Im doing this mod to my 3TGTE now, check my FaceBook site. Link below.

I think the best option is to install a 32 wheel in your dizzy and a second trigger to identify TDC, to do this you ue the 32 tooth wheel to identify the crank position and only use 1 tooth on the other wheel to mark TDC.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Class...537?ref=stream

Hope this helps,
Cheers,
Simon

[Javal]

First up - great idea for a thread. Fitting a modern style fuel injection system to an older motor is an awesome idea in my book. Keep that classic engine in the bay while reaping the power and reliability benefits that a (properly set up) sequential EFI system with flex fuel can give. I want to walk this path myself eventually when I can get my act together and build a neat 18RGTE.

One of the main hurdles - one you have acknowledged and Simon has proposed a solution to - is that you need a way to let the ECU know what part of the cycle the engine is on. Just having a crank sensor won't cut it, as Simon said, the ECU needs to see a 'home position' that is relative to camshaft position (remember, 2 complete crank revolution = 1 complete combustion cycle / however camshaft speed being 1/2 crank speed means 1 complete camshaft revolution = 1 complete combustion cycle).

Again, as simon pointed out, one way to do this is to modify the distributor (which spins at camshaft speed) to give this kind of signal. Modifying your original distributor it to take modified 4AGE distributor internals is the path he suggested. Utilizing the 32 tooth wheel in the 4AGE distributor to give an RPM signal (with greater resolution than a 2TGEU 4 tooth wheel) and then machining off 3 of the 4 teeth on the 4 tooth wheel which is also in the 4AGE distributor, using this one remaining tooth to give you a 'home' signal.

Another way to do this is to use a 36:1 trigger wheel bolted to the front of the crank pulley (to give RPM signal with even greater resolution) used with an externally mounted crank sensor, then use a 2TGEU distributor and modify the trigger wheel in the same manner as the 4 tooth 4AGE one, thus giving you a home position.

There are benefits and drawbacks to both of these methods. Personally i'd go with the second option, lock the distributor, make a blanking plate to do away with the distributor cap and mount 4 individual coils, thus rendering the remains of the distributor merely a cam sensor and allowing your ECU of choice complete control over ignition timing. That said 2TGEU distributors (and 2TGEU parts in general!) are becoming harder to find.

My 2c.

[ra_28]

I went with the 36-1 and modified the dizzy for a home signal for my 18gte. Works a treat. The only real hurdle I had was the sensor didn't match the trigger wheel.

Definitely keen to see more on the Fuel flex sensor. Autronic has just released its latest chip which includes flex fuel software. So I'm looking to upgrade mine to suit.

[king-szeitszam]

36-1 and modified dizzy is the only way to go, cheapest too. Was a while since I did it but should be some info on my thread as I had similar issues so have a read if you're keen.
hks7mgt did the mod before me and was a big help, so have a chat to him if you need a heads up.
Once you get the coilpacks all hooked up make sure you grind the posts off the dizzy cap and plug up the holes and paint over, makes for a nice swish look rather than an ugly unused dizzy.

[RAAAH23]

Thanks a lot guys +rep for all. So after looking into what each of you have said I think I'll scrap the rare earth magnet setup and sensor for a 36-1 trigger wheel on the front and will then only have to modify the dizzy to give me one pulse every time cylinder 1 is at TDC is that correct?

Sounds much more straight forward now. I think I'll try to find an electronic dizzy from a 21/22R and see if I can retro fit that in so it gives me one pulse for every rotation of the cam.

A trigger wheel like this should do the job correct? http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/3...eel-p-181.html

You and I both ra_28. I want the extra yet somewhat safer power of E85 but don't want to restrict myself to only going from E85 pump to E85 pump. So it will cost slightly more but worth the convenience in my eyes. I had to upgrade the injectors to ID 1000's (Bosch) which were not that expensive at $100 each. The fuel delivery set me back more than double that figure. I went with a Bosch 044 as an inline lift pump feeding an aftermarket industries 2.6L surge tank with an internally mounted walbro 460lph E85 compatible pump. I'm thinking about installing a filter between the celica fuel tank and Bosch 044 and another filter after the surge tank and walbro. I know the fuel flex sensor is placed on the fuel return line but don't know if it will make a difference if its placed before or after the FPR.

[TA22 GT]

Here's a pic of the internals of the 4AGE dizzy before I modified it. More pics on my Face Book page.


I decided against using a 36 tooth wheel on the crank, main reason is it runs at twice the speed and has a greater tendancy to vibrate and cause signal issues to the ECU. For me the best option is a modified dizzy that contains the 32 tooth wheel as well as a home signal.
I also plan to use this in place of the stock dizzy and then run 4 separate twin post coils.

Its a bit of mucking around but I think its worth the effort. I cant see why you couldn't modify a dizzy to fit a 2TG, maybe the 4AGE would be a good choice, also a dizzy from a Mazda RX7 is similar and probably a better choice for the 2TG, it has the 32 tooth wheel and 4 tooth which you could reduce to have just one home signal.
https://www.facebook.com/pages/Class...537?ref=stream
Cheers,
Simon