ITB Conversion on 16 valve 4AGE

[ReardriveAutosLtd]

Hi Guys, I am new to this forum and am still finding my way around it.

Can anyone help me with info on doing a ITB Conversion on my 16 valve 4AGE.

Parts required, a guide to how, links to products needed...... I will have a set of 20 valve silver top throttle bodies.

Can I run the standard ECU?

All info will be greatly appreciated. Thanks.

[dnegative]

http://www.toymods.org.au/forums/eng...-4age-16v.html

Here you go

[wiso]

There are many differant ways to go about this, which way you want is up to you and your budget.

Most get the T3 adapter and do the minimal basics. I have gone about mine in a stupidly differant way. Going overboard and taking ages to do it. But I have done it on a very slim budget. actually I have spent less on the whole ITB kit and kaboodle including the original silvertop manifold than the T3 adapter costs on its own.

But it has taken alot of stuffing around.

A basic run down of what I have done.

I took the original silvertop manifold and hacked the crap out of it, I cut the whole ISCV ports off the top and began rounding the runners until I got to this. I put bars on top and bottom to support the manifold and keep it all in line. as they taper I had ribs put on the end so a hose doesn't slip off.



got myself a smallport manifold and cut the flange off it



because I have a bigport I filled in the spaces to seal the intake flange. Just means I have a step on the inside.



Using 50mm x 50mm silicon hose joiners i joined the 2 parts of the manifold. I also drilled and taped in 4 vacum tees.



I went very over the top with mine and also put large barbs in so I made an idle bypass pipe so I could bleed air past throttle butterflys if I needed to. not a necessary step but I want idle control.



My idle control bleed valve



I also modified the stock 16v throttle bodies ISCV, plated the back and added a brass barb. and mounted it.



When I put them on the car I had to change my fuel reg to a corolla one, got a smallport item as it tails off to the side, the stock MR2 one has a screw on fitting that fouls my setup.

You can also see here you need a vacumn block, I cut the top of the silvertop ISCV runners in half and sealed it together. and put barbs in the bottom. this then had enough factory vac nipples to use all my items from. Mine can be seen at the top of that photo. My wiring loom had to have the plastic corner removed and straightened out. For the main fuel feed line I filed half the stop away so i could rotate the line a little more as the curvature it came down on fouled the manifold. Since my manfold no long joins solid to the engine I had to make a ground extension wire for the manifold ground. I fixed them together and extended it to the head. I also made a brace under it to support it, like the original manifold has




As I am running mine on a stock Bigport AFM ecu I had to make a box to seal all the throttles to the AFM pipe. I tried using a the blacktop airbox but I could quite fit it, due to my runner length. so i modified it and couldn't get it to seal properly. So i am currently working on a new idea.



I made myself a dodgy test item out of PVC and sikaflex while I make a new one, But the result was great, the car drives and idles better than it did on the stock manifold. Has full cold start idle and sits at about 1000rpm for normal hot idle.




This is just the method I used, I am a tight ass thats the only reason for it. if I had the money I probably would have thrown it towards the T3 item.

But you end up buying a few brass barbs and other odds and ends along the way.

[xero]

http://www.toymods.org.au/forums/eng...-4age-16v.html

Here you go

all of this. do not look at anything else but the above link as it a ginormous waste of time.

programmable ECU WILL BE REQUIRED. dont listen to the special people who say it will run with a stock ECU because it wont. sure you bodge it and get it running good at Wide Open Throttle but it will idle like shit and be a complete pig unless you are completely up.
you dont have to buy a $2000 ECU. a second hand adaptronic, which seem to go for around $500 on average, will be more than enough.

[mattysshop]

well i pretty much proved that it runs fine on the stock ecu when i did it about 8 years ago......

initially i had my map sensor hooked up to the vac nipples along the bottom - giving it a single feed, what i forgot to do is the same for the fuel reg, and run it off one of the fittings on the s/t ITB's.. which as i know now is NOT on the right side of the throttle body... this was causing part throttle richness/overfueling...

later i did go full after market (adaptronic).. but this was after about 6 months of daily driving it with the stock ecu, and the FPR/map hooked up to a vac block.

its far from being a 'pig' and you don't have to bodge anything other than wire in the 20v TPS (reverse of 16v TPS)

[dnegative]

well i pretty much proved that it runs fine on the stock ecu when i did it about 8 years ago......

I cant see how on 16v electronics, I hooked it all up and at idle/low RPM there was fuck all vacuum.
It was just pouring in fuel as it was seeing 80kPa at idle, look at the throttle and it would spike to 100kPa, that MAP signal with the factory manifold on would be like 3/4 throttle. I tried tuning it with speed density, quickly gave up and went for alpha-n which is how everybody tunes these things (although if you have the money and dyno time, you can do a combination of speed density and alpha-n)

Yeah it will run but cruising around at 10:1 with no idle control or cold start is not running fine.


Only way to do it on factory management would be to use a AFM 16v setup and an airbox as per Wiso.

[mattysshop]

i don't run cold start on mine currently, and it's got a standard intake... no cold start works fine... idle control was fine... it was almost a little carbyish when you first started if it was parked outside on a 2 deg morning..

cranked fire and give it a few small revs on the throttle - then it would idle at 800.. when warm it would go to around 900. (thats how i set mine at least)

i remember taking a picture of a boost gauge i hooked up to the vacuum block, i'll see if i can find it as i cannot remember what it read, and i also throew a mates wide band logger on there to check AFR's and MAP. i have a few screen shots of part throttle, and WOT.

once i sorted the FPR vac (such a noob mistake on my part) it ran extremly well, and still averaged approx 400km to a ae86 tank.. mixed city/freeway.. which was about 80-100km's less than i got previously with a stock bigport (car was a jdm ae86 coupe), and with an AE92 GZE (got the same fuel economy).

[trdee]

the blacktops ran MAP sensors so there must be a way of getting a good MAP signal.

that being said in this day and age, a programmable ECU is SO cheap that there really isn't much point trying to run it on a stock computer.

[dnegative]

Blacktops ran blended alpha-n and speed density.

Matty are we talking open throttles on a 16v map ecu or something else? 20v idle control is vadtpy different to how a 16v does it.

[mattysshop]

probly should have outlined what my setup was initially! sorry.

*ae92 smallport engine
*full series 1 AE82 ADM Bigport Map ecu/harness/injectors/dizzy/map sensor (this is the one with the yellow 2 pin plug you bridge to get codes, not the Diagnosis block with te/te1 & E1) from a mates 86' twincam seca - this one had the pink injectors.
*20v TPS wired in reverse to AE82 one
*S/T ITB's on t3 manifold open throttles - trumpets/unifilters.
*custom made vac block (pretty much same as the ones you can buy) brake booster, MAP signal, and FPR run off this.
*the preinstalled 3/16 (i think they were small anyway) hose barbs that are on the T3 manifold, i made 5/16th, and run them all in so it was like a bit of a balance also between the ITB's.

the dodgeyest thing i did was run the linkage stop screw as the 'idle' control..

but really it ran pretty faultlessly... it was a daily i drove to and from work through inner city suburbs of brisbane, heavy traffic and everything...

back then i didn't really care how it worked.. it just did.. so i just went with that.. i ended up getting a good swap/deal for an adaptronic fitted and tuned (RPM/TPS no map used) after about 6 months of driving it like that.

[mattysshop]

would a new 3/4 wire o2 sensor make any difference? i don't know how tempremental they are with one actually working.. i know that a buggered o2 sensor or lack there of doesn't bother them too much at all.. but i have never bothered fitting a new single wire, or changing to a pre heated type.

[trdee]

i found my engine used a shitload more fuel if the o2 sensor was faulty/disconnected/etc? i wouldnt say they make little difference

[mattysshop]

really? maybe i should get a new one then? currently i get about 7.5L/100km for my pretty standard ae92 SX? (roughly 450km's between fuel lights)

i havn't had mine plugged in for over 6 months since redoing the exhaust before xmas! (snapped it off)

i really didn't think they did much on the bigport and smallport? i had a S/T 20v once that hated life when it was disconnected..

in proper working order do you think they could help with running ITB's?

[trdee]

On my stock bigport AW11 a leaking exhaust manifold gasket caused the O2 sensor to read lean and it pumped fuel into the motor. Fuel economy plummeted till I sorted it out. Not necessarily an O2 sensor fault there, but it was pretty clear that it had the capability to make a decent impact on fuel economy depending on how it failed. 7.5L/100km is a pretty damn good figure though so clearly in your case it wasn't hurting the situation much

Don't know in regards to ITBs, the O2 sensor is only really supposed to adjust the mixture at cruise and so on. I'll have a read through the tech article I have on the stock ecu and its functions when I get home and see what it says in regards to how much adjustment the O2 sensor is capable of.

[trdee]

bugger, the article i have is on the very very early UK aw11 ecus which didnt seem to run a cat over in the UK, so no extra info about what the O2 sensor does here.

still it's a good read if you guys want to learn more about how the MAP ECU works on the 4As

https://github.com/sparkiedk/Toyota-...).pdf?raw=true